Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Talk about anything that floats your boat (no pun intended). This is general talk about anything not related to boating/fishing.
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perchin
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by perchin » 08 Jun 2010, 17:10

DocWatson wrote:
wasilvers wrote:I'm taking another position here - just because big brother can't have his cake and eat it too.

The Governement charges a spill tax on EACH barrel of oil pumped. This tax was 8 cents a gallon - at just about 5,000,000 barrels a day production in the US alone, that's $146 million dollars a year supposedly taxed and held as spill cleanup funds. Who knows what they do with this money, but they've been collecting it for years. If they charge a spill tax, it doesn't seem right that BP (who has paid this tax religeously) should be required to pay for every dime of the cleanup. Isn't this double taxation?

Big brother just voted to raise this tax by 400% - or over HALF A BILLION dollars a year in cleanup funds.

BP's interest in stopping the leak is only financial- oil lost to the sea is not $ in their pocket. Now they also have a PR nightmare on their hands because of their foolishness.

Just a tax guy with an opinion...
If what BP is being charged were a tax, I'd probably agree with you,IF this mess falls under the definition in that tax statute of the word "spill".

But they are being fined for negligence and deliberately sidestepping or bending safety regulations for financial gain. They gambled.... we lost, they have to pay and pay and pay and pay until it's clear to all the oil companies that we will not tolerat this any longer and that it is not worth the risk. Even if we have to bankrupt a couple of them in the process to make a point. Big business should not be permitted to influence government. It's a recipe for disaster because their interests and missions are diametrically opposed.

Just an old hippie with an opinion. :wink: Image
AMEN to that!!!!!!!!!!!! =D>

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Nevillizer
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by Nevillizer » 08 Jun 2010, 17:18

Personally, I am tired of hearing about the big oil machine and the government mismanagement of the whole thing. Here's my opinion as a business owner.

If I was involved in a situation that everyday cost me a similar % of dollars, got me an immeasurable amount of bad press, my stock was dropping and had everyone focused on what I did, I would: Do everything in my power to mediate the situation, fix the problem, and get back to business as usual as soon as possible. I think that all the people involved in it are probably doing exactly that. They are trying everything in the book. The thing is this isn't a quick fix for something like this.

My heart goes out to all those impacted by it, but the phrase "Don't cry over spilled milk" comes to mind. It happened. We can't take it back. So lets stop it, fix it, and move on and do the best we can.

The back and forth blame game is getting old. And as far as business influencing government goes, its been happening as long as there has been government. As long as there are greedy businesses, there will be greedy politicians getting paid.
Well behaved people rarely make history!

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wasilvers
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by wasilvers » 08 Jun 2010, 17:32

DocWatson wrote:they have to pay and pay and pay and pay until it's clear to all the oil companies that we will not tolerat this any longer and that it is not worth the risk. Even if we have to bankrupt a couple of them in the process to make a point.
True, unfortunately paying the fines will just come out of our pockets. The other guys will get on board and raise prices right along with BP.

I'm such a pessimist. :cry:
Will - Originally from Texas, now fishing for Bass in Wisconsin
1978 Sea Nymph Fishing Machine rebuilt in 2009

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perchin
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by perchin » 08 Jun 2010, 19:55

Nevillizer wrote:Personally, I am tired of hearing about the big oil machine and the government mismanagement of the whole thing. Here's my opinion as a business owner.

If I was involved in a situation that everyday cost me a similar % of dollars, got me an immeasurable amount of bad press, my stock was dropping and had everyone focused on what I did, I would: Do everything in my power to mediate the situation, fix the problem, and get back to business as usual as soon as possible. I think that all the people involved in it are probably doing exactly that. They are trying everything in the book. The thing is this isn't a quick fix for something like this.

My heart goes out to all those impacted by it, but the phrase "Don't cry over spilled milk" comes to mind. It happened. We can't take it back. So lets stop it, fix it, and move on and do the best we can.

The back and forth blame game is getting old. And as far as business influencing government goes, its been happening as long as there has been government. As long as there are greedy businesses, there will be greedy politicians getting paid.

and if your buisness could have the same effects on our great fishing, enviornments well being, and could effect millions of people. And you did not take the proper saftey steps, nor have an emergency plan of action in place in the event of this........ Than you should by all means be expected to do everything in your power to mediate the situation.... and if that means it costs you more than 75 million, too bad. Our family are also business owners..... I just meant that IT DON'T SEEM RIGHT TO BE ABLE TO CAP ACCOUNTABILITY.

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juggernoob
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by juggernoob » 09 Jun 2010, 13:36

wasilvers wrote:
True, unfortunately paying the fines will just come out of our pockets. The other guys will get on board and raise prices right along with BP.
And you don't think this will happen regardless? But I guess we can all blame ObamaOil for that, cause BushOil was so much better. :USA1:

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wasilvers
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by wasilvers » 09 Jun 2010, 15:09

I want a bio-diesel truck. If they spill a barrel of source material,, the birds eat it up, or it grows into more product. #-o

:LOL2:
Will - Originally from Texas, now fishing for Bass in Wisconsin
1978 Sea Nymph Fishing Machine rebuilt in 2009

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Nevillizer
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by Nevillizer » 09 Jun 2010, 17:26

perchin wrote:
and if your buisness could have the same effects on our great fishing, enviornments well being, and could effect millions of people. And you did not take the proper saftey steps, nor have an emergency plan of action in place in the event of this........ Than you should by all means be expected to do everything in your power to mediate the situation.... and if that means it costs you more than 75 million, too bad. Our family are also business owners..... I just meant that IT DON'T SEEM RIGHT TO BE ABLE TO CAP ACCOUNTABILITY.

That cap went out the window the moment the first death of a person was confirmed. I agree with the accountability and am not taking up for BP. But the contractors who was doing this for them should get equal heat as well. I think that all who had their fingers in the pie should pay. Which of course include our so called regulators from the government. In short, I believe they are doing as much as that can be done to fix it and I expect them to take care of all the fall out and those impacted by it. They can't afford to shun off their accountability nor do I expect them to.
Well behaved people rarely make history!

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DocWatson
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by DocWatson » 09 Jun 2010, 18:34

Well, I'm watching the nightly news and it looks like today was the day the Image. It's all downhill from here and anyone who thinks that all is being done that can be done and we should just trust the arrogant @#$%*s who run the companies that did this, I have some coastal property in Arkansas I'd like to sell you. #-o
If Life Gives You Melons,
You May Be Dyslexic.

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shamoo
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by shamoo » 10 Jun 2010, 23:30

perchin wrote:
DocWatson wrote:
wasilvers wrote:
Just an old hippie with an opinion. :wink: Image
AMEN to that!!!!!!!!!!!! =D>
RIGHT ON BROTHA!!!!!!!
Club Soda-Not Seals

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shamoo
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by shamoo » 10 Jun 2010, 23:38

I was watching a CNN show, they were talking how BP could some how dissolve the company, which would mean there would be no more BP, thus putting the burden of the clean up and stopage of the leak on the tax payers.($$$$$$$). Can they do that?
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jackinok
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by jackinok » 12 Jun 2010, 16:09

hate me if you must but being a old time oil person,,I must play devils advocate here a little.In the first place ,no one has proved either negligence or wrong doing (yet).second,bp is NOT the only owner in this well,there are more,including the federal gov that makes BILLIONS of dollars off oil in the gulf.third ,to really understand what is happening here you need to have at least some knowledge of what they are talking about.The media niether has or wants to know ,its more newsworthy to show the poor birds.the 75 million cap was for cleanup,it goes into a general fund that all oil companies pay in case something like this happens.I think "o"lifted it,all lawsuits or whatever ,regardless how much, is on bp,no cap.In fact bp will have to pay the wages of the oilfield workers of every rig in the gulf that the federal gov shut down,including each and every service co.Even though they could be working.believe it or not,BP has done some pretty good things considering well is a mile deep,has ungodly pressures,and their working on something never done before.

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wolfmjc
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by wolfmjc » 12 Jun 2010, 21:22

okay, just a comment here, we own a gas station and talking about fee's and such that come out of everyones pockets, whenever a station buys a load of fuel we pay a "fee" that goes into a superfund in case of any type of spill, this is true of every gallon of gas or bulk petrolium product in the united states........this is just on the sales level and does not include any fees on shipping, production or other forms of distribution. when you start adding in city, county, state then federal tax's and fee's.......people do not realize just how much the gov regulates and controls the whole shebang.....so in my opinion the blame game we keep hearing should be shared upstairs a little more.... :|
Doc, like the smilies.....lol

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Bugpac
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Maybe I Have Been I the dark.......

Post by Bugpac » 13 Jun 2010, 12:19

Obama needs to release the order and let the foriegn ships come in. I think Unions are great for those that want them etc, dont get me wrong. But we need more ships out there cleaning, and its gonna take foriegn ships to do so... I myself will not stop buying from BP, they are not corporate owned, and realisticly anyone buying from total, Citgo, Flying J etc, are getting gasoline/diesel made via crude from a BP rig.. Its not like they refine there own crude for there stations specifically.. This is good that people talk of a bp boichot tho, as it is keeping the other greedy oil companies from raising prices to 4 or 5.00 a gallon and proffiting from others losses..

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