Win A Longtail Mud Motor Kit

If you have some experience at Kayaks and canoes, and are a little innovative, then I need your help.

I'm looking for a simple way of rigging a canoe with a homemade setup to house a 3hp Harborfreight Predator motor, mounted on a Mud-skipper 5-7hp Longtail Kit.

There are several things that need to be considered.

1. The engine will be mounted behind the rear seat, and the steering handle will come alongside the driver.
2. I envisage the motor being set off to one side of the kayak. Perhaps even supported by a strut going to an outrigger?
3. The Recoil start cord will be hard to reach, if correct positioning isn't considered
4. The Outrigger Buoyancy tank could be a 4" Sch 40 pvc pipe.
5. The outrigger supports need to be easily detachable from the canoe, and fit many different styles.
6. The standard Longtail Transom Mount should be employed here.

The best idea will win the kit! Post your ideas, photos and drawing here please.

Now this sounds fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :beer:

Just a couple of thoughts.

About the recoil start: The very aft end of a canoe or kayak is not a nice place to be for a larger person. Especially when you are trying to yank on a rope. How about a set of weld on or bolt on "guides" added to the handle (think like on a fishing rod) and use those to route an extended recoil rope further forward. An extended choke actuator would be a very welcome idea, too.

About the handle: These smaller, self propelled watercraft can be quite narrow, making steering with a tiller sometimes difficult. Is there a way that the handle itself could be offset slightly? Even a very slight offset could make a big difference in maneuverability. Also, I doubt most folks would be standing up while operating such a rig. The handle would need to be kept low to facilitate a seated position. However, not so low that the longtail couldn't be lifted out of the water.

About the outrigger: I dunno if 4" PVC would handle the needed stability requirements. It would be really neat to see a pair of outriggers (one on each side) that were shaped like the hull of the craft, only miniaturized. These could be made from stitch and glue construction, fiberglass, or whatever. They would just need to be large enough to offer the extra stability and have positive floatation.

About the outrigger struts: This would depend entirely on the craft. For a squareback canoe, It would be pretty cool to be able to tie the outrigger struts into the transom and another amidships. A craft with oarlocks could have a mount to take advantage of the oar receptacles to act as a strut anchor point. I wonder if it would be possible to even make another anchor point on the motor mount itself.

Please take in mind that I am not trying to be a picky little butthead. I'm pretty much just thinking out loud. I do hope that some of these ideas are useful. I really wouldn't mind winning that kit. LOL! I may even do a drawing in the next day or so and try to put my ideas into visuals.

Wonderful stuff! Post pictures - drawings etc.

this is the first idea that popped into my head, i am sure you want more technical drawings but i am supposed to be working now. the pivots may need to be changed, a lllooonnggg pull cord added. i have always liked the mud motors, never had one or run one.

i got to thinking about this again last night, you would have to have a stabilizer on each side. then the next part that might be tricky would be finding the right balance point on where to make the transom. i believe that the transom would have to be installed on a per customer basis due to weight (forward/aft) to keep the balance right. then another thought was a keel of some sort to keep it from going all over the place. a canoe should'nt be too bad. as far as transom you could use angle aluminum with screw inserts fiberglassed to the bottom of the vessel and a piece of wood for the motor mount.

Below is my idea, but pardon any incorrect lingo.
On a kayak the motor would need to be set in a forward position. You could make it be able to pivot up and down to bring the propeller out of the water, as shown in part B. Push the whole handle forward and the motor tilts up. I imagine needing to use support floats on both sides, as shown in A and C. They would need to be height adjustable (C-2) and the mount would need to be wide, like an upside T, so the float wouldn't spin.

Part A.
1. Handle rest
2. Starting cord pulley, to make it easier to start
3. Starting cord handle, pulls toward your chest or right side
4. Handle that controls throttle and rudder
5. Rudder, with 90 degree total range of motion as depicted by orange lines.

I envision the throttle handle would work like a motorcycle, twist for higher speed, but then also the handle would rotate from vertical to horizontal to change the position of the rudder.
Part B, shaft rest could be integrated into the motor support bracket, so that the motor sits at an optimal angle. You could include shims (rubber?) to have additional bolts further back on the bracket, distribute the stress, and make it more universal.


Alright, now in true designer fashion, everyone get to ripping apart my concept and tell me why it's wrong. :LOL2:

I like it, pretty close to my ideas. Much better drawings than mine

For tiller, OP with off-set tiller just is a pain in the tail on canoes. Consider rigging a joy-stick in front of stern seat. It'll take bit of space, but conceivably would negate the necessity of having the engine off to one side.

Consider a "balcony" assemblage on stern of canoe, with some consideration of need for weight in front of craft. Centered motor eliminates a bunch of issues.

Have fun, be safe.

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=330757#p330757 said:

lovedr79 » Sun Sep 29, 2013 7:22 pm[/url]"]I like it, pretty close to my ideas. Much better drawings than mine

Click to expand...

Is there a way you can make your picture bigger? I can't really see it.
Sorry if my drawing is a very close to yours, I promise I'm not trying to steal your idea. I enjoy the design aspect, but I can't say I'm motivated to win the motor as I would rarely be able to use it around here. I'll leave that to you.

When you get down to it, it seems like there will be a lot of limitations on what you can do on a kayak setup.
There won’t be a way to turn the propeller shaft from port to starboard without some type of gearing to make up for the lack or range of motion when in the kayak. Either that or some type of stick steer system. That's why I incorporated the rudder. Then, like you said, you'll have to use a long pull cord to start it. The issue gets to be that if you have too many controls around you, it will hinder your ability to fish. That's also why I used dual small supports in the rear, as they wouldn't get in your way. The idea for that was based off of the Freedom Hawk Kayak. I foresee the left handed versus right handed controls debate. I always feel more comfortable running a tiller with my left hand, but I'm sure there are plenty of people who'd rather use their right. The ability to easily get the propeller out of the water will also be challenging, depending on the weight of the setup. Also, the motor will probably need to be easily removable as it will weigh as much as some kayaks. Some kayaks also have rear storage which will make placement trickier.

I think a square back canoe could utilize a very straightforward design. The traditional style canoe would be a bit more problematic as the motor would have to either sit very high, to make the angle, and/or sit very far back where there is less buoyancy.

i tried to make it bigger, plus the drawing was lost on my cell phone that went swimming. wasnt trying to say that you stole my ideas. i think we hit the design on the head by coming up with two that are pretty close. my drawing only has one pontoon, but after much thought you definetley need two.i kinda want one now..........

i dont think there is a way to get around control cluttter, as the boat doesnt have much room to start with. i drew mine with left hand controls too for whatever reason thats the way it hit the paper. a ghenoe would be optimal for this setup kind of like the natives in south america.

well by gholly! i do still have the picture.

Don't forget that the object of this exercise is to utilize a mud-skipper longtail motor

See mud-skipper.com for details of the transom mount

We will also use the HF 2.5hp engine

Thanks

Here's a 2.5hp predator longtail mounted on a Beavertail Final attack:




Good luck with your contest!

Could use a piece of 1/4" aluminum plate on the top and bottom side of the deck and bolt the motorbase to that.

]Ok I hope very one can under stand this
You are going to make what will look like a ladder.

Step 1 : Cutting
Conduit      22'     X    1 "
Cut electric conduit        2 ea. 48"
                                               4 ea.  30"
                                               2 ea.  24"
PVC  pipe.     6" x   10'
Cut PVC pipe.                   2 ea.   36"

Cut Pool noodles.           6 ea.   36"

Step 2 : Out riggers
Cut one end of each PVC pipe at a 45deg angle
Take 3 noddles force in one tube
Cut flush with ends
Seal ends with silicon

Step 3 : Ladder
Lay 2 longest conduit parallel
take all 4 of the  36" conduits and make a mark 3" from each end.
take one 36" piece and lay one 48" piece on top at a 90 deg. At the 3" mark
Making sure that the longer one is not overhanging but even
Drill hole through the center of the tubes at mark and bolt together Make sure it square
Repeat at the other end of 36"
Then doing the same  at other end of  48"
Turn frame over lay PVC against the end lay another 36"  next to it snug and mark on 48" and aline with 3" marks drill and bolt together both ends
Wrap strapping around Pvc pipe and electric conduit at each end of ladder.At  2 places and bolt together

Step 4:  transom  mount
Mark  center of both 24" and drill & bolt aluminum angle 2x2x12" to both make sure it square and end of angle is even with tube
Mark both ends of angle 4" from end and 1  1/2" from top
Take 2x6x24" lumber cut in half clamp both pieces to 2x2x12" angle making sure both ends are  even with angle and 6" is up right drill and bolt
Now transom mount can be off set as need for handle ( make sure enough room for handle to move left and right while seated)
Mark 48" frame where the 2 -24" will set. Set in place drill and bolt together



Use 2 Ratchet tie downs to go around your boat to frame and tighten down where you want the motor to set.


If needed step 4 can be off set to ether side of the boat.
The frame  length  can be shorten for smaller boats.
If the outriggers needs to set closer to water add wood blocks on top of the outriggers where they meet the frame
Would also suggest taking another Ratchet and going around transom mount to inside lip of boat or seat
With outriggers, should be no problem to spin in your seat and choke and start motor

Tools :                                                              Material :
Drill.                                                                   Conduit.     3 EA.       1 " x  10 '
Tape measure.                                              PVC.             1.                6" x 6'
1/4" Drill bit.                                                 Angle.           1.                1/16x1  1/2 x 4'
Hacksaw.                                                       Ratchet       1.                Pack w/4 inside
Wenches.                                                         Conduit strap.              25' pack
Socket.                                                             Silicon.          1.                Tube
Caulking gun.                                                  Pres. Treated.             2x6x8'
                                                                           Noddles.        6.             Large
                                                                            Bolts             25.          1/4 x 2 1/2"
                                                                            Bolts.             2.             1/4 x 5"
                                                                            Lock nut.      27
                                                                            Washer.         27.
I have drawings but having trouble posting them

Here is one

#2

Ok I see my tool list and material got mixed.
So you just have to read one line at a time.
You'll see that some material continued on the next line.