Advice on 4 vs 2 stroke maintenance costs

I'm about to take the plunge and re-power my old runabout.
I attended the recent boat show in Toronto, hoping to better understand current outboards and make a sound decision for my next motor. Before going to the boat show, I knew my heart was set on getting a Mercury 50 ELPT504S or Yamaha F50.
After talking to sales reps at the show, Instead of getting closer to my next OB, I Suddenly find myself having more questions and more confused than when I started.
I was introduced to the Evinrude ETEC 50 and how it will cost me less in terms of maintenance and overall ownership costs, while having more fun due to low end torque.

The Mercury and Yammie are about CAD$1900 cheaper...taxes in, with the usual 3 year warranty.
However, the ETEC comes with a 7 year extended warranty and free rigging. These prices will only hold until end of March.

My boating needs are simple....fishing and the occasional cruising with the family....possibly towing the two girls (ages 16 and 11). My boat is a 1959 Mirrocraft and is 16'...72 inch beam, 56 inch stern.

I don't want to make this into a 4 vs 2 stroke debate. I just want anyone's FIRST HAND experience regarding maintenance costs of ETEC vs their 4 stroke counterparts.
Of course, please feel free to tell me any negative features between the two engines I've mentioned that would make ownership a nightmare. In the end, I just want to make sure that the money I will be spending is for me to be fishing and not at the shop having a change oil or having maintenance issues.

Thanks in advance to all!

Either should serve you well. The fourstrokes are super quiet but the etec is really no noise maker. The 1900. Hundred saved on the yammaha and mercury is probably just the difference in the etec with the extended warranty. 6 one haf a dozen of the other. With the 4 stroke yammaha I had, maintenance was easy enough to do at home. Oil and filter change once a year only took a few min. For me it would be where I got the best deal and felt like customer service after the purchase would be best. Good luck.

Thanks for the reply AllOut...
You mentioned that you did your own maintenance. I assume this is because the motor was out of warranty already? I was quoted that the yearly maintenance for the 4 stroke would cost something like CAD$600....
This is the selling point of the ETEC rep. That the ETEC wouldn't need maintenance until 3 years of ownership.
If I do my own maintenance on a brand new Yammie or Mercury, that might void my warranty?

Depending on where you live and how many dealers are in your area you may help yourself by choosing the brand that is well supported in your area.
A suggestion to you would be to find out as much as you can about the local dealer who will be taking care of the engine for you. A good dealer is worth his weight in gold when you need him.
Am assuming you are going to purchase locally?
If not, then dis-regard the above statement as you will be put at the back of the line compared to folks who DO purchase locally. An authorized dealer simply has to look up the serial number of a brand he is a dealer for to determine the selling dealer.

Rob Silver said:

Thanks for the reply AllOut...
You mentioned that you did your own maintenance. I assume this is because the motor was out of warranty already? I was quoted that the yearly maintenance for the 4 stroke would cost something like CAD$600....
This is the selling point of the ETEC rep. That the ETEC wouldn't need maintenance until 3 years of ownership.
If I do my own maintenance on a brand new Yammie or Mercury, that might void my warranty?

Click to expand...

I did the maintenance while the motor was under warranty. Oil and filters were bought at the dealer where my boat and motor was purchased. They kept it on file as well. It didn't affect my warranty.

AllOutdoors said:

Rob Silver said:

Thanks for the reply AllOut...
You mentioned that you did your own maintenance. I assume this is because the motor was out of warranty already? I was quoted that the yearly maintenance for the 4 stroke would cost something like CAD$600....
This is the selling point of the ETEC rep. That the ETEC wouldn't need maintenance until 3 years of ownership.
If I do my own maintenance on a brand new Yammie or Mercury, that might void my warranty?

Click to expand...

I did the maintenance while the motor was under warranty. Oil and filters were bought at the dealer where my boat and motor was purchased. They kept it on file as well. It didn't affect my warranty.

Click to expand...

I was told that maintenance on 4-strokes required belts and pulleys being re-tensioned, as well as the mandated 100-hr oil and filter change. Another huge cost to 4-stroke engines was the replacement of belts.
If you were able to do all that, would you say it was an easy enough endeavor? What amount of time did you have to put in? Did you ever replace belts on your Yamaha? Did you do it yourself or did a Yamaha tech need to do it for warranty purposes?

Sorry for the questions, but I am really trying to get as much info as I can before plunk down a huge chunk of change. Thanks again!

Pappy said:

Depending on where you live and how many dealers are in your area you may help yourself by choosing the brand that is well supported in your area.
A suggestion to you would be to find out as much as you can about the local dealer who will be taking care of the engine for you. A good dealer is worth his weight in gold when you need him.
Am assuming you are going to purchase locally?
If not, then dis-regard the above statement as you will be put at the back of the line compared to folks who DO purchase locally. An authorized dealer simply has to look up the serial number of a brand he is a dealer for to determine the selling dealer.

Click to expand...

Hey Pappy. Yes, I will be purchasing locally. This one dealership I am talking to sells both Yamaha and ETECs. They say I should go with ETEC....but then again, I am wary since it is about $2K more and I feel that's where they want my money to go so they can have more of it as well.
All three engines are well represented from where I will be running, so servicing wont be too much of a concern. My concern is this:

1. The 4-strokes are ~$2000 cheaper.....but most likely would cost more to maintain?
2. The ETEC sounds like a dream with the 7 year warranty and 3 years/300 hours first maintenance call.....but I've been burnt before by "sound to good to be true"
3. The ETEC IS ~$2000 more....is it worth 2 grand more than a Yammie? Really?
4. Which tech is easier for me to maintain in terms of DIY?
5. Which tech is cheaper for me to maintain in terms of DIY?

Thanks again! Your inputs are much appreciated!

I've never heard Evinrude and reliability mentioned in the same sentence.

Rob Silver said:

AllOutdoors said:

Rob Silver said:

Thanks for the reply AllOut...
You mentioned that you did your own maintenance. I assume this is because the motor was out of warranty already? I was quoted that the yearly maintenance for the 4 stroke would cost something like CAD$600....
This is the selling point of the ETEC rep. That the ETEC wouldn't need maintenance until 3 years of ownership.
If I do my own maintenance on a brand new Yammie or Mercury, that might void my warranty?

Click to expand...

I did the maintenance while the motor was under warranty. Oil and filters were bought at the dealer where my boat and motor was purchased. They kept it on file as well. It didn't affect my warranty.

Click to expand...

I was told that maintenance on 4-strokes required belts and pulleys being re-tensioned, as well as the mandated 100-hr oil and filter change. Another huge cost to 4-stroke engines was the replacement of belts.
If you were able to do all that, would you say it was an easy enough endeavor? What amount of time did you have to put in? Did you ever replace belts on your Yamaha? Did you do it yourself or did a Yamaha tech need to do it for warranty purposes?

Sorry for the questions, but I am really trying to get as much info as I can before plunk down a huge chunk of change. Thanks again!

Click to expand...

I bought the motor in 2006 I believe. 90/65 jet. All I ever did was change the oil and filters and run the fire out of it. I sold it to a friend that has a house on 2 different rivers and he probably puts twice as many hours on it as I did. He still has the boat and motor and it has never been in the shop. All he does is change oil and filters. Now back to the etec.... I would not be afraid of it either, and like I said the extra cost for it is probably the extra warranty. You could see what the cost difference would be by purchasing an extended warranty on the 4 stroke, If your concerned about a warranty. Also weight......of the engines compared. I know the 4 strokes are getting lighter but do not know the difference in the etec and the 4 stroke. Just another thought, if weight is an issue, to help muddy the waters more in your decision.[emoji12]

The Etec down in the horsepower range you are looking at are pretty darned reliable. Since I "retired" at the end of 2008 I have been working part time at an Evinrude dealership.
In that time I have been there we have NEVER seen a major failure of one of the low horsepower Etec engines. Ever. The failures we do see are the same as that of the 4-strokes. Folks leaving the engines for a year and then trying to run them on bad gasoline. No engine will make it through that.

How about fuel economy? Are they the same? Gas won't be under $2 for long.

What the weight difference is should be considered. If the cost difference was no so much the etec would be a no brainier. They last longer. The 50 etec is a detuned 60 so that's good and I know the Yamaha 70 is sweet. If the Yamaha 50 is the same engine as the 70 then it's probably nice. Check the weight and if the Yamaha is a detuned 70. Merc makes one good engine and it's the 300hp. The rest are a cluster. 7 year warranty.....How much of the 1900 is paying for it?

Rob Silver said:

AllOutdoors said:

Rob Silver said:

Thanks for the reply AllOut...
You mentioned that you did your own maintenance. I assume this is because the motor was out of warranty already? I was quoted that the yearly maintenance for the 4 stroke would cost something like CAD$600....
This is the selling point of the ETEC rep. That the ETEC wouldn't need maintenance until 3 years of ownership.
If I do my own maintenance on a brand new Yammie or Mercury, that might void my warranty?

Click to expand...

I did the maintenance while the motor was under warranty. Oil and filters were bought at the dealer where my boat and motor was purchased. They kept it on file as well. It didn't affect my warranty.

Click to expand...

I was told that maintenance on 4-strokes required belts and pulleys being re-tensioned, as well as the mandated 100-hr oil and filter change. Another huge cost to 4-stroke engines was the replacement of belts.
If you were able to do all that, would you say it was an easy enough endeavor? What amount of time did you have to put in? Did you ever replace belts on your Yamaha? Did you do it yourself or did a Yamaha tech need to do it for warranty purposes?

Sorry for the questions, but I am really trying to get as much info as I can before plunk down a huge chunk of change. Thanks again!

Click to expand...

You were told wrong. Sounds like the sales pitch of an ETEC salesperson. At least in relation to Yamaha F50, since I know nothing of the Merc 50. Belt never needs tension adjustment. Valve adjustment isn't needed for many years for most recreational use. Commercial, where it's used 8 hours a day 5 days a week, first time in the first year, beyond that I think every 500 hours or something. I've never once put a belt on a Yamaha, not once. I take that back, a customer ran his F25 out of oil and destroyed the crank and both rods, so I rebuilt it and at the same time put a new belt on it...just because. That was the only one I can remember even messing with the belt. The bigger motors, yes, DOHC with variable cam timing, yeah they'll need a tension adjustment once in a great while but we're talking about an F50, not an F350. I have an F25 myself and had an F50 on the same boat for a while (2002 model, carbureted). Change oil once a year. Usually put 25-40 hours a year on a motor if I run it a lot, like all weekend long 3 days. My 25, about 15 hours a year. I just change it because I feel bad about not doing it, even though the manual says differently. Call me a maintenance freak I guess.

ETEC is correct in that they don't recommend servicing until 3 years. But here is the deal with them. You have to run their specific engine oil. If not, you must have the engine's ECU recalibrated. In other words, if it's in a "clean burn" calibration to run their oil, and you can't find any at your location or anywhere near your location, you're screwed, you drive a while to find it. Or on the flip side, you have it recalibrated to run "richer", and then that negates the whole selling point of the ETEC in the first place, "clean burning" 2 stroke. And that is the ONLY selling point of those motors...They are not lighter, faster, quieter, smoother, etc. Read the fine print on the "3 year maintenance" schedule too. IIRC they still ask you to inspect a few things including, but not limited to, the impeller, among other things well before the 3 years is up. Then, not to mention that if you forget to put oil in the tank, it limits the engine speed..or just burns up. I think it just won't run. That is a commonality with all 2 stroke engines, premix and autolube both. If the oil pump fails, you're screwed....and if that happens in the warranty period, and they find air in the pump, it's on you (no warranty) since they can say that it was run out of oil at that point. Such the same can be said of any 2 stroke oil injected engine of any brand, but I've seen this happen with Evinrude as of lately, at local dealers. When is the last time anyone saw a 4 stroke Yamaha oil pump die?

I can tell you first hand that the F50 is a SWEEEET motor. You will do an oil change once a year but it's worth the "hassle". That engine, at idle speed, is silent. The loudest noise you year is the pee water hitting the lake. Or if you take the cowling off, you can hear the injectors ticking. I kind of wish I'd have kept mine but it was really too much motor for the little 1548 boat I had it on.

Biggest problem with any outboard is fuel quality. The ETEC being a 2 stroke, if the fuel gets old, it's really hard not to burn up the motor...and no warranty does not cover that problem. It runs so lean already that if it goes any leaner, it's almost guaranteed. The Yamaha is a LOT more forgiving, in fact, it will let you know if the fuel is horribly bad. It just won't run right, e.g. poor acceleration, will not reach max RPM, etc. The engine will not hurt itself.

Yamaha cannot deny warranty if you do your own maintenance. Just keep up with your service records and receipts. Chances are good that you won't even need to use your warranty, but if you do, it's always good to keep up with what's been done and when. The dealer might try to do stupid stuff, but if they do, call Yamaha's customer service directly and they'll set it straight. I don't know how Merc and Evinrude do theirs, maybe it's mandatory service on their stuff by the dealer...I don't know. Yamaha certainly doesn't do it that way.

Maintenance on a F50 is $600CAN? What's the ETEC guy smoking? Oil and filter is what? $40 in Canada? Impeller (if it would need it) is $35. If you paid a dealer to do it at $100/hr, you're looking at $100 labor to do both since it takes about an hour. So $175. Do it yourself, keep records, and save yourself almost $200, and nothing to worry about. The Yamaha is still a really simple motor so easy to work on.

Your ETEC salesman should be slapped for putting out that kind of misinformation!

RiverBottomOutdoors said:

I've never heard Evinrude and reliability mentioned in the same sentence.

Click to expand...

Care to elaborate?
Any first hand experiences with ETECs? Yammie F50 or Merc ELTP50?
I'd like to know.

Thanks.

[/quote]
I bought the motor in 2006 I believe. 90/65 jet. All I ever did was change the oil and filters and run the fire out of it. I sold it to a friend that has a house on 2 different rivers and he probably puts twice as many hours on it as I did. He still has the boat and motor and it has never been in the shop. All he does is change oil and filters. Now back to the etec.... I would not be afraid of it either, and like I said the extra cost for it is probably the extra warranty. You could see what the cost difference would be by purchasing an extended warranty on the 4 stroke, If your concerned about a warranty. Also weight......of the engines compared. I know the 4 strokes are getting lighter but do not know the difference in the etec and the 4 stroke. Just another thought, if weight is an issue, to help muddy the waters more in your decision.[emoji12][/quote]

The current motor I have on the Mirrocraft is a 1989 3cyl 50hp Mariner....it's said to be 217lbs.
The F50 weighs 249 lbs and the Merc is 260 lbs. The ETEC 50 weighs 250 lbs....so there's no weight savings here between the 2 and 4 stroke....so weight isn't currently a factor in choosing the motor.

If the $1900 difference accounts for the extended warranty, that sure is a steep price for it! That would mean that the motor itself is just around $6000-$6800, and an additional $1900 means that the warranty represents ~25% of the motor price. Even my car doesn't have that high of a warranty ratio.

I'm beginning to think that I can save a lot of money by going with the 4-strokes here.

Pappy said:

The Etec down in the horsepower range you are looking at are pretty darned reliable. Since I "retired" at the end of 2008 I have been working part time at an Evinrude dealership.
In that time I have been there we have NEVER seen a major failure of one of the low horsepower Etec engines. Ever. The failures we do see are the same as that of the 4-strokes. Folks leaving the engines for a year and then trying to run them on bad gasoline. No engine will make it through that.

Click to expand...

THIS makes me feel a little bit more at ease with the ETEC. I have been watching so many Youtube videos now of the 25-75 hp ETECs and I see that they are relatively quiet and doesn't blow smoke like my current motor.
You saying that these things are nearly trouble free makes me consider them.....albeit the price difference is just pecking at that part of my brain which makes decisions.
I wonder what the resale of these ETECs are compared to the 4-strokes? Maybe I should be considering that as well?

This is exactly what I was trying to avoid.....having more questions and not getting any closer to a decision.

Stumpalump said:

7 year warranty.....How much of the 1900 is paying for it?

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I would love to know the answer to this as well. This remains the primary point of why I am unable to commit to the ETEC. The price is just too far from the 4-strokes.
But the draw of the ETEC is at an all time high as well after seeing those ETEC Youtube videos!!

A dealer may be able to help with that answer. Oil changes on the 4-strokes are recommended at the first 20 hours then every 100 hours or 1 year. When we do an annual on a 4-stroke it consists of compression check, oil, filter, engine fuel filter, gear oil, grease engine, pull prop (remove fish line) grease shaft and replace prop, change spark plugs (NGK are the only spark plugs we see failures on these days), grease steering etc. If there is a boat filter that is replaced as well. An engine/fuel system inspection including timing belts is also performed. Rarely are valve adjustments done. Add this up over 7 years and the costs may be closer.
Changing oil types on an Etec is a non-issue. Should you want to go to the XD-100 a computer is hooked up to the engine and it is changed to run it however if it is on anything but XD-100 you can run pretty much any oil including XD-100 anytime you want.
Oil costs do account for some of the annual service costs of a 4-stroke.

XD 100 needs injection so don't run it in anything else or it does not mix well. Dump some in a clear jug and watch it sit on the bottom. You can shake it and it still does not mix well. Same with castor bean oil the old dirt bikes ran. You have to shake the can like spray paint to get it to mix.
I went from a Johnson 6 hp to a Honda 7.5 when I was a kid. I lived on a river and drove it daily. 10' boat so it swamped or sank from rain at least two or three times a year. The Johnson was simple to dry out but the Honda took all day. I wonder how hard it is to dry out these new 2 and four stroke engines? We don't plan on it but small boats do dunk once in a while.

Couple things with the E-tec. They're probably the cleanest "green" motors with a 3 star CARB rating. The e-tec have what I'd say is some of the strongest pistons in a factory motor, some kind of NASA grade aluminum. They even have a NASA patent number on the piston. If your setup to run xd 100 and you run regular oil and a 50:1 mix in your tank in a pinch like suggested your still going to under oil the motor and possibly do damage because the E-tec is direct injected meaning the gas never travels through the crankcase like a standard 2 stroke outboard. They have oil injection in key locations in the crankcase to keep the crank and rods lubed. I've read that the e-tec hardly use any oil in the first place. I'd guess it would be less then what you burn now with your mercury. Probably can't go wrong with any motor you choose. I'm just a 2 stroke fan.