Redwood

[Dennis Wilson]

Good morning.....

Just researching a bit for my winter project. The original seats on the 1958 Alumacraft were redwood and as the brochure states, redwood was used to keep the price down. Let's just say that was true in 1958 but not today. I have found some used wood on Craigslist but four of the five people did not even reply; just the way it is on Craigs these days, but I have time and I am in no hurry.

I bought some redwood semi-transparent stain on clearance at Menards and might try to use this stain on something similar to redwood. This morning, I saw this boat online (inserted picture) and the seats on the boat are wood and I think they are close enough to redwood that I could get by with them using the stain I have. What I need to know is what wood is/was used? You see it all the time but I never thought about it until now. Is it mahogany?

And a PS.... what wood could be be substituted for redwood where I wouldn't have to throw in my billfold?

All ideas/suggestions very much appreciated. Thanks.
Dennis

 

[Dodgeboy49]

Do you know any contractors? I've gotten redwood from decks that are being demolished before; there was enough rot to not make salvage/resale worth the contractor's time, but there was enough good stuff to be worth my time to pick through.

I also watch the 70% off pile at the local Big Box lumberyard relatively closely. I don't know if it would give the appearance you would want but it seems like cedar deck boards show up in there fairly regularly. I've never seen redwood on the pile in my area.

 

[mbullen]

If you're not familiar with wooden boat building, its easy to google the most commonly used species for different applications.
That would be a proper idea, anyway.
But ultimately, seat tops are barely structural and they're certainly above the waterline. In my book, anything goes.
In fact, I have an old Crestliner with several sets of different cool boards that I stumble upon and change out regularly like a framed picture.
All that being said, the usual suspects are marine ply, mahogany, and white oak.
Add teak, cedar, fir, and ash to the second team.
And to be fair, the old Crestliner even has a set of rainbow popular and birch boards just because they were pretty. Lol
You're going to seal any of them anyway.
I would only offer to avoid anything treated.

 

[LDUBS]

Anything I would likely sub for redwood will likely cost more. In my neck of the woods, compared to oak or mahogany, redwood is going to be the least expensive. Though, I can see clear redwood boards carrying a pretty high price. Exterior plywood is going to be easiest on the pocketbook and probably what I would use. Stain it the color you want. Like any other wood product, it would need to be sealed well.

BTW, I can't see clearly in the pic you posted, but think those seats are plywood.

 

[Dennis Wilson]

I was able to do some work on the seats yesterday and removed one to take it apart to "analyze" what is there. The seats obviously are not original and I have choices to make now. We put the boat in the water for the first time yesterday to see if it leaked.... It was the wrong day to do this as the lake launch area was just short of white caps but we held it at the dock for a bit and there were no leaks up front at all... there was about one ounce of water back by the drain but that might have been inadvertent. I won't know until I get the boat in the water on a calm day and that will be next spring. But I learned enough to know that the boat is well worth restoring and I will do that. I am not sure if the seats are plywood but they are definitely oak. I also found that the guy who built them not only used screws, but glue... they are NOT salvageable at all... and if I go back to original, I will use cedar.... simply because redwood isn't even stocked locally let along in the width I would need... the local Menards does stock a 12 inch cedar board and a 12 foot length.... along with the cedar I found on the curb locally (free) I can beef the cedar with some treated 2x4s covered/disguised with cedar covering it.... But that will come next spring. My concern was if I could launch and retrieve the boat with my bunk trailer and had a friend with just in case... I didn't need him and had no problem. Put a 1975 4 HP Evinrude on it and that moved it good enough through the rough water. We both agreed that this experiment would be the roughest water this boat would ever see and we had no problem at all.... so I will keep the boat and restore it this fall, winter, and spring... I also found the complete brochure for 1958 Aluma Craft boats but nothing specific to the "Queen of the Waterways"... just the AL series where all the information matches this boat. The boat is currently upside down on the trailer so I can work on the hull.... the old boat numbers from both WI and MN have been removed as well as the ugly paint. I traded the old mismatched oars for a couple decent restorable oars.... The boat plug is unusual and no marine outfit or supplier can really duplicate it but I can replace the entire assembly.... that will not be necessary. I installed a new rubber gasket (same as a garden hose gasket) for the old black hard rubber gasket. It did not leak at all and seemed to be very secure. If I don't lose that plug, I am in good shape... if I do lose the plug or want a modern plug system, that is pretty easy to do as well.... but I would like to keep it original.... There is a fitting on the back transom on the boat and I assume that was/is there for a light? or perhaps to hold a flag?

PS.. I found the boat to be VERY well built and still "tight" after all these years... the couple areas I have cleaned up look new.... and that will continue. I have had many years of experience (since 1968) restoring so I have all the tools to make this boat look new.... and that is the plan. I will take one shortcut though and use "cedar" instead of "redwood" but I do have redwood semi transparent stain to make it similar looking and instead of styrofoam under the seats, I will collect some old orange life jackets that are a dime a dozen to use under the seats. and yes, out of sight....

There isn't much else to write.. will send current pictures.. thanks to everyone for suggestions/ideas/help... keep 'em coming.

 

[LDUBS]

That is a terrific boat.

Suggest you avoid pressure treated lumber as the chemicals are corrosive to aluminum. Not sure 2x4 supports would be needed anyway. Adding a winch to the trailer would make loading easier. Perhaps think about replacing the roller bracket someone put on the winch post with a rubber bow stop. By the way, if the drain plug you mentioned is threaded you might be able to source spares in the local plumbing aisle.

 

[airshot]

You can akso get laminated plywood, in my area you can get most any nice wood laminated onto exterior plywood, might be cheaper...mabey ??

 

[Dennis Wilson]

I guess I should have sent the most current pictures. First, I moved the roller to the back of the converted kayak trailer so the bow hits this roller to allow the boat to load easier. I did install a decent new strap winch but don't need to use it... I can pull the boat on the trailer with just a bow line.... When I replace the transom wood it will be with cedar.... the new cedar seats will be 12 inches wide and I will use treated 2x4s under the seats to beef them up a bit.... and for the cedar facade pieces to attach to....and finally, I did go to the big box stores and plumbing stores too... the threads are not NPT so I went to the marine supply stores looking for the "old guy" that works there that could answer this question.... there was no help.... only the suggestion that I remove the current assembly which is easy to do, and replace it with a modern plug system... also easy to do.... I should be working on the boat today... but... it's already been a long day. Next step is to clean the hull of mold/mildew and then start the sanding process although I won't use the suggested methods on the videos.... they got too aggressive. I think I could finish the restoration in a long weekend, but I will take my time. And a PS... I will check back periodically with digital pictures. Every vehicle I have restored has been documented with digital photography after digital was invented.... I have worn out two cameras..... on my third....

Take care

 

[Dennis Wilson]

PS... will use two treated 4x4 blocks to use as a bow stop.... they will be totally painted and designed to look as though they belong... also, they will use plumber's rubber on the front that contacts the bow aluminum....

 

[Dennis Wilson]

winch

 

[Wayne Roberts]

I was able to do some work on the seats yesterday and removed one to take it apart to "analyze" what is there. The seats obviously are not original and I have choices to make now. We put the boat in the water for the first time yesterday to see if it leaked.... It was the wrong day to do this as the lake launch area was just short of white caps but we held it at the dock for a bit and there were no leaks up front at all... there was about one ounce of water back by the drain but that might have been inadvertent. I won't know until I get the boat in the water on a calm day and that will be next spring. But I learned enough to know that the boat is well worth restoring and I will do that. I am not sure if the seats are plywood but they are definitely oak. I also found that the guy who built them not only used screws, but glue... they are NOT salvageable at all... and if I go back to original, I will use cedar.... simply because redwood isn't even stocked locally let along in the width I would need... the local Menards does stock a 12 inch cedar board and a 12 foot length.... along with the cedar I found on the curb locally (free) I can beef the cedar with some treated 2x4s covered/disguised with cedar covering it.... But that will come next spring. My concern was if I could launch and retrieve the boat with my bunk trailer and had a friend with just in case... I didn't need him and had no problem. Put a 1975 4 HP Evinrude on it and that moved it good enough through the rough water. We both agreed that this experiment would be the roughest water this boat would ever see and we had no problem at all.... so I will keep the boat and restore it this fall, winter, and spring... I also found the complete brochure for 1958 Aluma Craft boats but nothing specific to the "Queen of the Waterways"... just the AL series where all the information matches this boat. The boat is currently upside down on the trailer so I can work on the hull.... the old boat numbers from both WI and MN have been removed as well as the ugly paint. I traded the old mismatched oars for a couple decent restorable oars.... The boat plug is unusual and no marine outfit or supplier can really duplicate it but I can replace the entire assembly.... that will not be necessary. I installed a new rubber gasket (same as a garden hose gasket) for the old black hard rubber gasket. It did not leak at all and seemed to be very secure. If I don't lose that plug, I am in good shape... if I do lose the plug or want a modern plug system, that is pretty easy to do as well.... but I would like to keep it original.... There is a fitting on the back transom on the boat and I assume that was/is there for a light? or perhaps to hold a flag?

PS.. I found the boat to be VERY well built and still "tight" after all these years... the couple areas I have cleaned up look new.... and that will continue. I have had many years of experience (since 1968) restoring so I have all the tools to make this boat look new.... and that is the plan. I will take one shortcut though and use "cedar" instead of "redwood" but I do have redwood semi transparent stain to make it similar looking and instead of styrofoam under the seats, I will collect some old orange life jackets that are a dime a dozen to use under the seats. and yes, out of sight....

There isn't much else to write.. will send current pictures.. thanks to everyone for suggestions/ideas/help... keep 'em coming.View attachment 116602View attachment 116603

That's a real nice Alumacraft 14 footer you have there............my take is keep her original if you can so Redwood would be my choice if I were project manager.......). I would even put copies of the original decals on it rear sides.

 

[Dennis Wilson]

I tried for the redwood... but honestly, the budget just isn't there for that... but cedar and redwood are so close and I do have a gallon of semi-transparent redwood stain that should get them close to original... as for the decal you can see what the original was on this boat but they were both pretty shabby... and I was surprised that I could find some VERY close replicas... they arrived early this week and will be installed next spring.... I also found the complete 1958 manual for all Aluma Craft boats but nothing specifically for the "Queen." But over all I have most of the restoration questions have been answered and we did get it in the water (very rough water) with a 4 HP Evinrude on the back... which did a good job.... Making progress!!Try to get this one done for under $300 including the $200 I paid for the boat... so far, so good and it looks like the final number will be $279 for everything except the labor....and he works real cheap.. ME.

 

[airshot]

Painted or not, no pressure treated lumber anywhere near aluminum would be my choice !!

 

[sonny1]

I Have a bunch of Red Oak left over from building some really sharp kitchen cabinets. Plan on using Red Oak for the transom and use some to top off the seats on my little Lone star. Have a planer and will take the seat covers down to about 1/4 inch with a nice router edge. Should look sharp when I am done. Have no clue on how to seal it up but when the time comes will be asking a lot of questions.

 

[Wayne Roberts]

I tried for the redwood... but honestly, the budget just isn't there for that... but cedar and redwood are so close and I do have a gallon of semi-transparent redwood stain that should get them close to original... as for the decal you can see what the original was on this boat but they were both pretty shabby... and I was surprised that I could find some VERY close replicas... they arrived early this week and will be installed next spring.... I also found the complete 1958 manual for all Aluma Craft boats but nothing specifically for the "Queen." But over all I have most of the restoration questions have been answered and we did get it in the water (very rough water) with a 4 HP Evinrude on the back... which did a good job.... Making progress!!Try to get this one done for under $300 including the $200 I paid for the boat... so far, so good and it looks like the final number will be $279 for everything except the labor....and he works real cheap.. ME.

I understand my friend and fellow Alumacraft owner! Wood prices have gone through the roof and that is for certain so I understand cost wise. As you said the cedar and stain will be really nice also. I would put 3 coats of satin Marine Spar Varnish (light steel wooling between coats) as a protective top coat on the wood. Spar Varnish is formulated for exterior conditions. I have 2 1950's era Alumacrafts and one 68 model 16' Alumacraft Yukon and as you are doing I restored them having to compromise here and there on some things. I went with White Oak for the wood restoration on these and picked up decal sets for them on eBay age appropriate for the boats. I get a lot of compliments from guys who know boats regarding these old Alumacrafts. Don't worry if she seeps water a little...........that's very common. Just get yourself and old plastic Clorox jug, cut it at an angle and make your self a cheap baler..........works every time.....) Keep up the good work...........you got an awesome boat!

 

[Dennis Wilson]

I have restored a bunch of boats as well.... and the last one was a 16 foot Cadlillac... I found it at a garage sale... no kidding..... it had four rivets that were leaking and also my restored Lund boat had a few leaking too... nothing serious. I read a lot of forums and came up with the product that seemed to be the most recommended... It was simply called a "marine sealant" in the silicone tube department and I bought a tube for $17. Supposedly it hardens like a rock and last for years. They didn't lie... it was true... it worked great. I have not found if there is a leak in the back of the boat but I have to buy some of this to seal the transom when I build new wood pieces for that out of cedar too.... and a dab of this product on all the holes where the bolts go through so one tube will get all this done. When I tried to start on the hull (the boat is now upside down on the trailer) I got enough gunk off it initially to see that someone had used this marine sealant on the bottom of the hull sealing three/four rivets on the underside... I sealed my rivets from the top side.....

https://www.menards.com/main/paint/...-c3f4-45a7-9095-e10d8bb23654&ipos=1&exp=false
I also ran across the next solution to the seats too... The old seats are not original but two of the three main seats have styrofoam under them. For some reason, the third one does not and the bow seat does not have the styrofoam either. Since these were all screwed and glued, they do NOT come apart without being destroyed. When I do the new seats out of cedar I needed to at least try to get some styrofoam under each seat.... and of course, I thought about old orange life jackets... a dime a dozen at swap meets/garage sales..... and repurpose them... and today, I hit a garage sale on the way back from the lake and there was a great beginning.. seven of them.... brand new..... 50 cents each... whoo hooo...

As far as the leak I will find it, seal it, but you still need something to use to bail rainwater etc... I use a container but when I get down to the end of it is just a little water, I use a "sponge" from the big box store that is designed/used for removing the leftover grout in kitchen projects.... very large and they work super....

https://www.menards.com/main/floori...-3d73-4bc6-84d1-73dd9712a283&ipos=1&exp=false
Fished today, and hit some garage sales.... will start on the hull tomorrow morning... have a good one...

 

[Wayne Roberts]

I have restored a bunch of boats as well.... and the last one was a 16 foot Cadlillac... I found it at a garage sale... no kidding..... it had four rivets that were leaking and also my restored Lund boat had a few leaking too... nothing serious. I read a lot of forums and came up with the product that seemed to be the most recommended... It was simply called a "marine sealant" in the silicone tube department and I bought a tube for $17. Supposedly it hardens like a rock and last for years. They didn't lie... it was true... it worked great. I have not found if there is a leak in the back of the boat but I have to buy some of this to seal the transom when I build new wood pieces for that out of cedar too.... and a dab of this product on all the holes where the bolts go through so one tube will get all this done. When I tried to start on the hull (the boat is now upside down on the trailer) I got enough gunk off it initially to see that someone had used this marine sealant on the bottom of the hull sealing three/four rivets on the underside... I sealed my rivets from the top side.....

https://www.menards.com/main/paint/...-c3f4-45a7-9095-e10d8bb23654&ipos=1&exp=false
I also ran across the next solution to the seats too... The old seats are not original but two of the three main seats have styrofoam under them. For some reason, the third one does not and the bow seat does not have the styrofoam either. Since these were all screwed and glued, they do NOT come apart without being destroyed. When I do the new seats out of cedar I needed to at least try to get some styrofoam under each seat.... and of course, I thought about old orange life jackets... a dime a dozen at swap meets/garage sales..... and repurpose them... and today, I hit a garage sale on the way back from the lake and there was a great beginning.. seven of them.... brand new..... 50 cents each... whoo hooo...

As far as the leak I will find it, seal it, but you still need something to use to bail rainwater etc... I use a container but when I get down to the end of it is just a little water, I use a "sponge" from the big box store that is designed/used for removing the leftover grout in kitchen projects.... very large and they work super....

https://www.menards.com/main/floori...-3d73-4bc6-84d1-73dd9712a283&ipos=1&exp=false
Fished today, and hit some garage sales.... will start on the hull tomorrow morning... have a good one...

Very good my friend! You have well thought out plans and it all seems to be moving along smoothly! Hope you got a good catch of fish too........)

 

[Dennis Wilson]

Fishing has been awful this year. I now only fish one day per week. Minnesota has made the daily limits unbearable. Had one of those moments yesterday that some people will never see. Caught my third small northern pike, about eight feet from the boat a huge muskie came up and grabbed the northern and took off. Fun to watch. Will try to experiment on the hull with dawn soap, and another area with mineral spirits, but mostly, I will use a velcro sander with a bag attachment and also wear a pro dust mask and start with 180 grit on the hull... I used 220 on the sides and it took four of them to do a small area so I switched to 180 to start with and that will work just fine... for the keel, I will use the gator tool which will take some time, but this winter, I will have lots of time.... After studying the reviews on what to use to keep the boat relatively shiny, I came to the conclusion after reading all the reviews (thanks Amazon) that there is no one item that is perfect.... on my Lund, I gave up.... and painted the hull that is below the waterline, black. That was three years ago and it still looks great.

 

[Dennis Wilson]

Decided to avoid sanding the riveted areas so I don't tempt fate. This is an orbital sander with 180 grit. I am doing half the hull to show the comparison pictures. I tried some dawn and also so mineral spirits but they didn't do any stain removal. I also used a scotch brite pad and some bartender's friend and that works well and will probably be one of the final steps before waxing the hull. It just takes time. Today I will buy the Gator product at Walmart for the hand sanding of the rivet areas. and some of the dented spots on the hull too.... Will do two more sanding efforts on the shiny side... 600 or 800 grit and then finish with 1200 or 1500 grit.... need to experiment a bit... also have some 3000 grit used for color sanding cars but I don't think I have to go to that extreme for a finish that will probably never be perfect....

 

[Wayne Roberts]

Fishing has been awful this year. I now only fish one day per week. Minnesota has made the daily limits unbearable. Had one of those moments yesterday that some people will never see. Caught my third small northern pike, about eight feet from the boat a huge muskie came up and grabbed the northern and took off. Fun to watch. Will try to experiment on the hull with dawn soap, and another area with mineral spirits, but mostly, I will use a velcro sander with a bag attachment and also wear a pro dust mask and start with 180 grit on the hull... I used 220 on the sides and it took four of them to do a small area so I switched to 180 to start with and that will work just fine... for the keel, I will use the gator tool which will take some time, but this winter, I will have lots of time.... After studying the reviews on what to use to keep the boat relatively shiny, I came to the conclusion after reading all the reviews (thanks Amazon) that there is no one item that is perfect.... on my Lund, I gave up.... and painted the hull that is below the waterline, black. That was three years ago and it still looks great.

Haa Haa I hear Minnesota is making a lot of things unbearable nowadays especially living in the Twin cities! As to the Pike becoming bait for the Muskie YES that must have been really neat to witness. We have a similar fish down here in Florida called a Chain Pickerel but they are rarely caught. Alligators can be a nuisance when playing a fish in my area........when they sense the surface commotion over and over here they come! Great job on the hull preparation there you are doing! Gonna be a fine boat you will have!